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[AaronLee]

Sorry, just figured I'd bring this up, hopefully I'm in line doing so. I'm just brimming over the fact that I've found SF nerds at least as zealous as I am (likely moreso.) So that's why I'm jumping to post.

Anyway, the butt-end of podcast 12 got me thinking (a dangerous thing at any time :3) Anyway, I'm an aspiring SF writer (aspiring because I've failed at doing any freelance work so far) and I've always concerned myself with what the line is between SF and Fantasy. Does one exist? The questions are numerous.

I'll try and give my 2c first; In my experience as a writer, I've tried to push and outright break imposed definitions on the writing I get into. I try and contribute about the largest twist to any given sub-genre I can manage while still being tied back to my influences.

This means I've come up with some rather wild results. One piece was scientifically feasible; it concerns humans in the distant future engineering weaponized races and their insurrection and capture of one they've left alone for a while. The twist is; the engineered race (of human descent) was indoctrinated into Greek Mythology as a tool of control. The invading dignitaries pass themselves off as members of the Greek Pantheon to better convince the invadee of their power. The story draws a lot of parallels with staples of Greek story and mythology. Especially Homer's common "battle hungry hero" concept that I'm hopefully not just inventing myself .

So which of the two genres would this fall under?

So, sorry I'm rambling, I just have so much to get out. My father was a big influence on me, he had his own philosophy about him that likely formed a lot of what I hold close today. He once said that even Lord of the Rings, the widely known paradigm of high fantasy, had scientific or science fiction elements in it. This is mostly in the presence of so much background to the world in the story and appendices of the books that it almost explains itself and becomes more feasable than "Here's a king, here's a wizard, here's a story, that's it."

Right, I'm done. sorry if I've gone and done something completely daft. Rap me on the knuckles if need be and I'll set myself straight. Anyway, I'd love to hear feedback and get a discussion going.

[Kyle Voltti]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961

Which just muddles the whole question I'm sure

[zortic]

I'm not sure how important it is for the writer to focus on genre. I think the only real reason for defining genres is for marketing. I would focus on the kind of story you want to write and let the audience sort out it's "definition". Odds are that any story is going to overlap into several genres anyway.

Of course if you want to aim for a specific genre (whether for marketing or simply preference), then the trick is to compare it to samples of what you consider to be that genre (You might consider looking at the "Your SciFi Influences" thread).

My personal feeling is that once you've gone into some kind of a "scientific explanation" (either good or bad) you've stepped away from Fantasy and gone into Science Fiction. I'm not sure that once you've taken that step you can easily go back to fantasy. But I'm sure that's debatable
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[Kyle Voltti]

I would also say that when it comes to Sci Fi and Fantasy that you have to know what the rules of your world are so you can stick to them.

Lord of the Rings, for example, has books and books of documentation that was never in the stories themselves but which set up the background and rules of the world.

[Selezen]

Science Fiction: prose based on a scientific premise with science being a major part of the story.

Fantasy: prose set in a completely imaginary world with little or no basis in reality.

Oddly, most of what is generally classed as SF is actually fantasy. Anything set in the future is actually science fantasy, since it is in a proposed or imaginary future environment. The tag 'fantasy' is generally used to describe fiction set in a feudal, medieval type setting, but it can (and was, I believe) etymologically be used to describe the many future worlds that have been imagined for science fiction tales.

True science fiction is actually quite hard to find. H.G. Wells is close. Jules Verne is probably definitive sci-fi - 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea, for example, is based on the scientific premise of a submarine that can support a community underwater for a long time, which at that time was unheard of. It was also set at the time it was written. Edgar Rice-Burroughs Mars stories are another example of something that is based in science fiction, as it is (in theory) set at the time it was written, and introduces concepts that could at that time have theoretically been possible (the various rays and so on). It's even possible to include Moby Dick as science fiction due to the detailed descriptions of whaling and the integral part that the whaling plays in the story...if you want to describe the whaling methods as science. Harpoonology?

In modern times, I think Michael Crichton is an accomplished writer of true science fiction. His stories are based in science and the use or misuse of such. Avoiding the obvious Jurassic Park discussion here, I'll cite Prey as a good example - a story about a swarm of tiny machines that develop intelligence and belligerence towards thier human creators.

Star Trek, Star Wars, B5, BSg and all that are, to use a popular phrase, space opera. At the very best they are science fiction set within a fantasy environment. Star Wars is pure fantasy, even down to the knights with swords, but in a completely imaginary future environment. Science was not a factor in its conception!
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[Ben Paddon]

[AaronLee]

[zortic]

[ttallan]